John Hollinger's Cavaliers playoff post mortem

[CavsKermit]

We wanted him traded. Meaning a piece would come in to replace him. We literally let him walk and didn't find anyone to add to the roster to replicate his skill. No rebounding off the bench at all. I personally am more upset about that than the fact we bought him out.

It takes two to tango.

 

[Futuredome]

Bickerstaff screwed that up and made Love untradeable. Lesson learned by this board as well.

 

[Smooth]

The good news for both teams is that they have cards left available to deal with the issue. It is much easier to win in the market for a fifth-best player and some bench guys than it is to find an All-Star. That both teams have their core pieces and are still fairly young leaves them in a great position to build on that.

Unlike some of their free-spending brethren, both teams are in great shape concerning the luxury tax and in a position to upgrade the rosters in the offseason.

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[Randolphkeys]

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@Smooth is using Heuristic* thinking for realistic outcomes rather than stoking the fires of rage... I love it!




*https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heuristic

 

[shoes22]

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I mentioned this in the first reply of this thread...but do you think Koby will actually go into the tax this upcoming season? We don’t have any indication that he will. If he doesn’t, the point is moot.

 

[2 For The Brew]

@Smooth is using Heuristic* thinking for realistic outcomes rather than stoking the fires of rage... I love it!




*https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heuristic

The goddamm Huguenots have nothing to do with this!

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

We wanted him traded. Meaning a piece would come in to replace him. We literally let him walk and didn't find anyone to add to the roster to replicate his skill. No rebounding off the bench at all. I personally am more upset about that than the fact we bought him out.

At his salary he was a negative overall value. Zero chance we could have traded him and brought back a better player.

 

[Wham with the Right Hand]

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I firmly believe that nothing the Cavs could have done at the trade deadline and nothing Bickerstaff could have done differently during the Knicks series would have changed the outcome. This roster, even with a tweak, was not set up to beat the Knicks. They lost 6 of 8 to the Knicks this year. The first one was a fluke when Love and Wade combined to hit 14 3-pointers in the 6th game before the Knicks got Josh Hart.

So what now? Chris Fedor had a column that laid out Altman's thinking.

Obviously, we’re going to look at what we can do to adjust, but there’s no sweeping changes. No one’s going to panic off this first-round loss. - Koby Altman, 4/28/23

So FORGET ABOUT trading Allen. NO SWEEPING CHANGES.

Altman is banking mostly on internal improvement. He believes the young playoff first-timers will learn lessons from their debut on league’s grandest stage. Garland will be a better decision-maker and a more assertive offensive dynamo. Allen and Mobley -- a pair of non-spacers that Altman believes can thrive together despite the lousy playoff series -- will spend a summer in the weight room. - Fedor

Note: Altman thinks Mobley and Allen can THRIVE TOGETHER.

Don’t discount how we’re positioned for the future with this young talent that’s under contract that really enjoys each other. That’s why you don’t overreact to this one series. Knowing what you have in house and knowing that you have the runway you do have. We will look at all opportunities like we always have, but we’re going to invest in this group and give them the runway they deserve. - Altman

INTERNAL IMPROVEMENT, NO SWEEPING CHANGES. My question is - how long is this runway? Two more years? Three?

Our real upside is going to be the diversification of our offense through Evan Mobley, who’s 21 years old and just scratching the surface of how good he can be. He’s going to be an offensive weapon. He’s going to be a hub. He’s going to be a dude that we’re going to ask to rebound and push the ball and get us easy buckets in the transition. He’s just getting started. There’s a physical maturation that you’re just not going to have at 21, that at 25 he’s going to be vastly different. His growth has been exponential this year and it’s only going to get better. - Koby Altman

Feeling the urgency to add strength to his still-developing frame, Mobley is already planning to have a personal home gym built this offseason. - Fedor

So the plan is to maybe tweak the roster and wait for Mobley to go from being invisible against the Knicks to "an offensive weapon" and "a hub". My question is - will it take until he's 25?

Still, Altman recognizes the roster flaws -- pointing specifically to shooting, spacing and physicality. He has an offseason wish list. The Cavs have been hunting for a starter-quality two-way wing for years, coming up short in free agency and at the trade deadline.

One question Altman will keep asking: Are any of the in-house options capable of improving enough to reliably fill those spots? - Fedor

That’s a big one,” Altman said of the mid-level exception. “If you can add a rotational player through the mid-level exception … if you’re talking about adding one or two pieces to this rotation, than that’s substantial. - Fedor

So we can discuss all kinds of options on this board, but it appears the Cavs have a game plan. Be patient and count on internal improvement, especially from Mobley. Use the MLE to add a rotation player, hopefully a two-way wing.

If I were the Cavs I would have Wade and Okoro shooting 1,000 corner and angle 3's a week between now and the start of training camp. Mobley needs to develop a mid-range jumper, preferably from the elbows, and a reliable jump hook from 8 feet in. Sign LeVert - he got a lot more comfortable in his new role as the season progressed.

In training camp the Cavs need to spend a lot of time on offensive solutions to what the Knicks did to them in the playoffs - like blitzing Garland or Mitchell and forcing them to pass to Okoro or Mobley on the perimeter, and clogging the paint when Garland or Mitchell attempted to get to the rim. They have a lot of time to think about how they need to tweak the roster to give Bickerstaff solutions to the Knicks' defensive approach that was so successful.

They also need to come up with a defensive scheme that does not allow so many offensive rebounds. Like Hollinger said, what the Knicks did on the offensive glass was "almost comical".

 

[Dr. Claw]

Trading Allen is not ever going to net any sort of value, since the position is more or less devalued in the league if you aren't Anthony Davis tier. Turner (who I don't advocate trading for, not that Indiana would even do it -- though they almost seemed to be on that path with Ayton) isn't worth trading just because he spaces the floor. The only way the Cavs get anything good in return is if they end up in another situation that got Allen to the Cavs in the first place -- a team desperate to move a player they don't want to extend. Like someone trying to get a super star on their team.

Rather look for a PF that can guard 4/5 that can shoot to pair with one or the other if the matchup dictates it. Has the added benefit of not needing to play Mobley/Allen 35+ minutes a game together.

That PF for the Cavs was Kevin Love, but people forget how ass he was on the side of the ball we depend on him to be for the stretch he was. He didn't help Miami escape the play in, but made his mark in the playoffs. I don't like the buyout for a number of reasons, or that it even got to that point, but it is what it is. Wade was the hope, and that was a dud. Probably will get another chance next season. This was also why I wanted Diakite to get at least elevated to playoff rotation for this season. Or even on the Cavs at all. If he were younger and didn't cost as much, Robert Covington is the kind of player I like (and was being DNP-ed endlessly in LA. Some say it was because Lue was trolling his way out of that job, running 4 guard lineups).

As for Mobley, words can not express how frustrating it was to see Domantas Sabonis given all the room ever in the free throw area and beyond only for him not to shoot or to hesitate shooting/going to the hoop. If that were Mobley in this situation, he ends up with an easy 20/10. Allen, too, since he has shown that he can hit the 15 footer. In THAT kind of space.

In addition, a SF that could actually be usable in rotation. Again, sending Windler to Pangosville and filling that slot with Keita Bates-Diop (who could be had for cheap) goes a long way.

 

[gambler]

We wanted him traded. Meaning a piece would come in to replace him. We literally let him walk and didn't find anyone to add to the roster to replicate his skill. No rebounding off the bench at all. I personally am more upset about that than the fact we bought him out.

altman didnt even FUKN try.....

he trades love at the deadline and what comes back does not work...ok....shit happens....but not even trying after giving up everything for mitchell and having nothing left in assets?..the love contract was an asset and that asset no longer exists.

complete utter failure.

its just conjecture on my part but i believe that the players quit on either jbb or the front office in the knicks series. they knew they had no chance and played accordingly after game 3.

 

[cavsfever]

I firmly believe that nothing the Cavs could have done at the trade deadline and nothing Bickerstaff could have done differently during the Knicks series would have changed the outcome. This roster, even with a tweak, was not set up to beat the Knicks. They lost 6 of 8 to the Knicks this year. The first one was a fluke when Love and Wade combined to hit 14 3-pointers in the 6th game before the Knicks got Josh Hart.

So what now? Chris Fedor had a column that laid out Altman's thinking.

Obviously, we’re going to look at what we can do to adjust, but there’s no sweeping changes. No one’s going to panic off this first-round loss. - Koby Altman, 4/28/23

So FORGET ABOUT trading Allen. NO SWEEPING CHANGES.

Altman is banking mostly on internal improvement. He believes the young playoff first-timers will learn lessons from their debut on league’s grandest stage. Garland will be a better decision-maker and a more assertive offensive dynamo. Allen and Mobley -- a pair of non-spacers that Altman believes can thrive together despite the lousy playoff series -- will spend a summer in the weight room. - Fedor

Note: Altman thinks Mobley and Allen can THRIVE TOGETHER.

Don’t discount how we’re positioned for the future with this young talent that’s under contract that really enjoys each other. That’s why you don’t overreact to this one series. Knowing what you have in house and knowing that you have the runway you do have. We will look at all opportunities like we always have, but we’re going to invest in this group and give them the runway they deserve. - Altman

INTERNAL IMPROVEMENT, NO SWEEPING CHANGES. My question is - how long is this runway? Two more years? Three?

Our real upside is going to be the diversification of our offense through Evan Mobley, who’s 21 years old and just scratching the surface of how good he can be. He’s going to be an offensive weapon. He’s going to be a hub. He’s going to be a dude that we’re going to ask to rebound and push the ball and get us easy buckets in the transition. He’s just getting started. There’s a physical maturation that you’re just not going to have at 21, that at 25 he’s going to be vastly different. His growth has been exponential this year and it’s only going to get better. - Koby Altman

Feeling the urgency to add strength to his still-developing frame, Mobley is already planning to have a personal home gym built this offseason. - Fedor

So the plan is to maybe tweak the roster and wait for Mobley to go from being invisible against the Knicks to "an offensive weapon" and "a hub". My question is - will it take until he's 25?

Still, Altman recognizes the roster flaws -- pointing specifically to shooting, spacing and physicality. He has an offseason wish list. The Cavs have been hunting for a starter-quality two-way wing for years, coming up short in free agency and at the trade deadline.

One question Altman will keep asking: Are any of the in-house options capable of improving enough to reliably fill those spots? - Fedor

That’s a big one,” Altman said of the mid-level exception. “If you can add a rotational player through the mid-level exception … if you’re talking about adding one or two pieces to this rotation, than that’s substantial. - Fedor

So we can discuss all kinds of options on this board, but it appears the Cavs have a game plan. Be patient and count on internal improvement, especially from Mobley. Use the MLE to add a rotation player, hopefully a two-way wing.

If I were the Cavs I would have Wade and Okoro shooting 1,000 corner and angle 3's a week between now and the start of training camp. Mobley needs to develop a mid-range jumper, preferably from the elbows, and a reliable jump hook from 8 feet in. Sign LeVert - he got a lot more comfortable in his new role as the season progressed.

In training camp the Cavs need to spend a lot of time on offensive solutions to what the Knicks did to them in the playoffs - like blitzing Garland or Mitchell and forcing them to pass to Okoro or Mobley on the perimeter, and clogging the paint when Garland or Mitchell attempted to get to the rim. They have a lot of time to think about how they need to tweak the roster to give Bickerstaff solutions to the Knicks' defensive approach that was so successful.

They also need to come up with a defensive scheme that does not allow so many offensive rebounds. Like Hollinger said, what the Knicks did on the offensive glass was "almost comical".

Good post. I think you’re right about Kobys perspective. But Koby is talking like he’s totally confident that Mitchell will sign an extension and we have three or more years to build around him. Wish I was that confident.

I did appreciate Hollinger’s point about the resources we have available this off season if we go into the tax. I didn’t really understand that and it’s good to see.

 

[amil99]

God help us with these 2 idiots(Altman,JBB)

 

[B Mac]

The time to trade Allen would have been to the Jazz in place of Lauri and with the idea of receiving Bogdanovic along with Mitchell.

Garland/Mitchell/Bogdanovic/Markk/Mobley has 4 shooters in the starting lineup and all the spacing in the world. The Cavs would have still been too small to deal with big centers, but the hope would be that you could space them off the court. At the very least, it's easier to find a backup big man who can bang with guys like Robinson at the deadline, than it is to find a starting SF.

 

[Cavatt]

Pretty sure the Cavs are going into the tax this year.

You can say they should have this year, but I think it makes more sense to get the full MLE this year than going into the tax for Tim Hardaway Jr

They traded 3 guys who can shoot the 3 for Donovan. It was always going to hurt spacing. My biggest issue was releasing Love. That was not smart. Everyone knows he didn't forget how to shoot. Yes his defense was bad, but defense didn't lose us that series. We KNEW we needed spacing. It is the #1 problem with the roster.

I would have put Merril out there after Green didn't have it.

I am going to be mad if we don't have more shooting next year. That's it.

I hope the team is super embarrassed and looking at the playoffs like they should still be in it. They need to wise up and play with some fire. Felt like they died down against the Hawks last year. Need to answer the wakeup call

 

[foucault87]

I am sure Koby took 0 calls during the trade deadline. That is why we didn't make any moves. He probably put his phone on silent for the whole week and decided we don't need to make any improvements. Clearly that is what happened.