Let it all out. The Cavaliers Rant Thread

[MattyIce8]

It's at the 47:45 point in the podcast, and yes, it's worth listening to it.

Yep and if Fedor is actually willing to say that. Oh boy.

 

[foucault87]

I'm not sure Brunson is much better than Mitchell. They just have a better coach with a very clear identity on how he wants to play offensively and defensively, and their FO has done a good job adding the pieces to compliment Brunson and allow them to play how Thibs wants to play.

The biggest issue I see with the Cavs is an organization that isn't in alignment from the FO down to the coaching staff. This has resulted in being a defense-first team that claims they want to speed up the pace and space the floor, yet they play two bigs that can't shoot and have a PG that plays at one of the slowest paces in the league. Because the coaching philosophy doesn't make sense, the roster winds up being all disjointed.

Knicks know what they want to do. Thibs wants to control the pace offensively, slow the game down, and out-work/out-physical you defensively. Across the board, the guys they have on their roster are guys that have always played that way.

Orlando kind of plays similar to the Knicks, with more length but lacking in guard play. Still, they play to their strengths and mitigate their weaknesses as much as they can.

Pacers aren't going to stop you to save their lives, but they're going to run you into the ground and they have the personnel to do so.

Celtics built their team to have length and shooting all over the court with the goal of jacking as many threes as possible and being able to switch almost everything.

Philly's going to beat you up inside with Embiid and Maxey attacking the paint.

---

I'm not going to go through every playoff team, but the point is the majority have a clear style in which they want to play and have built their rosters to be able to play that way. We're 4 years into the JBB tenure, and it doesn't seem like the FO or the coach are on the same page in how they want this team to play.

The teams identity just doesn't match the personal. It also just doesn't exist. This is a failing on the coach to utilize the roster well and on the FO for assembling an I'll fit roster

 

[1290joe]

I'm not really here to bang the drum for Sexton, but are you of the belief that if you switched Garland and Sexton Utah would be a playoff team?

Not sure what garland has to do with this but the way he played this year probably not. He was incredible in 2021 though.

 

[Vee-Rex]

There are some wild takes in this thread but at this point... can't really blame them.

A year ago it felt you'd be ridiculed for wanting to fire JB ESPECIALLY during the offseason when people generally become agreeable with the team's choices (good or bad).

I wonder if those same staunch defenders and the "return everyone for another run" crowd still feel the same?

Maybe we find a way past the Magic but I don't see a world in which we beat the Celtics in the 2nd round.

 

[Jscc]

Yep and if Fedor is actually willing to say that. Oh boy.

Fedor is complicit in it. He has done nothing but kiss JBB's ass and be his mouthpiece for the past two seasons whenever things go wrong.

 

[The Oi]

They’re not hitting the fucking shots as is.

 

[Bob_The_Cat]

They’re not hitting the fucking shots as is.

Garland bricks wide open layup. After game: "Coach, we need you to get us better shots"

 

[inliner311]

Not sure what garland has to do with this but the way he played this year probably not. He was incredible in 2021 though.

It's because we were bring up that Sexton probably would have helped more than Garland. We were comparing Sexton vs Garland and not Sexton vs Mitchell. We don't have a #2 scorer at the moment and Sexton could have been that over Garland.

 

[Dylan Windler's Mom]

This shit crazy can't even beat the Orlando Magic to advance out of the 1st round. This rebuild is a failure. Gotta call on daddy LeBron to save us again

 

[1290joe]

It's because we were bring up that Sexton probably would have helped more than Garland. We were comparing Sexton vs Garland and not Sexton vs Mitchell. We don't have a #2 scorer at the moment and Sexton could have been that over Garland.

I would have signed garland to a big contract and traded sexton for Mitchell 10/10 times with the information we had in 2021, at least in that hypothetical scenario. He was a legitimate all star that year.

 

[inliner311]

I would have signed garland to a big contract and traded sexton for Mitchell 10/10 times with the information we had in 2021, at least in that hypothetical scenario. He was a legitimate all star that year.

Garland was a legitimate all star in a system that they dismantled by trading away Lauri. Also we never really got to see Sexton play with the triple towers. Levert also had problems fitting in to the starting lineup.

Koby push forward with trying to use 2 ball dominate guards in the starting lineup even though Garland had just thrived when they went away from it. It wasn't push forward with Sexton on a new contract but he pushed forward with a big trade with a lot of future assets.

A lot of the issues we have is because Koby and JBB just have never figured out a proper system they should run with the guys we have. We had mismatch pieces before the Mitchell trade and we still have mismatch pieces now. At least if you held steady with the players we had, you could gain information on what you needed to go to make everything work then make a trade when that was sorted out. I've said that even before the Mitchell trade. I also said once you start making trades that you will lose value with each trade, that definitely seems like the case now.

At the end of the day results are what matter and Koby/JBB might be out of a job at the end of the season because of it. Someone new will most likely have to sell their vision of the team to Dan Gilbert and figure out a way forward. Koby and JBB got their shot and it has basically failed.

 

[redscoon]

Altman clearly overestimated how quickly Mobley would develop. This team as constructed is only a serious playoff team if Mobley is at or at least very near Mitchell's level. If Jarrett Allen is your second best player, you are fucked. Period. That's not an insult to Jarrett, just the reality that he is an uber role player. You can't dump the ball to him in a pressure spot and ask him to go get you a bucket. You can't run your offense through him. He's excellent at his role, but that should be your 4th best player at least.

Punting consecutive trade deadlines and then watching the team wilt in the 2nd half and playoffs is also very alarming. It's a GM's job to identify upcoming issues before they happen. You are supposed to prevent the car crash, not simply try to repair it after the fact.

The Garland problem is another huge concern. His value is absolutely decimated right now. How is Altman going to navigate that? Even though it's getting clearer every day that he and Mitchell have a very limited ceiling together, there is very little recourse to move off of him and get anything of substance in return.

That's not even bringing JB into the equation. Altman has pissed away an entire season of watching this team demonstrate very little development under a coach who has obviously been in way over his head for multiple years. He had a free pass to fire him last offseason after the team tanked against NYK and got mentally and physically bullied. It had poorly coached team written all over it and yet we find ourselves in the exact same spot a year later.

Is he really dumb enough to think JB wasn't a huge problem? The only other logical explanation to me would be he realized he built this roster poorly and that there was nothing he could do in the offseason to significantly change it. As a result, he keeps JB around to take all the heat and be the fall guy when things inevitably go south again.

 

[kevincleveland]

Altman clearly overestimated how quickly Mobley would develop. This team as constructed is only a serious playoff team if Mobley is at or at least very near Mitchell's level. If Jarrett Allen is your second best player, you are fucked. Period. That's not an insult to Jarrett, just the reality that he is an uber role player. You can't dump the ball to him in a pressure spot and ask him to go get you a bucket. You can't run your offense through him. He's excellent at his role, but that should be your 4th best player at least.

Punting consecutive trade deadlines and then watching the team wilt in the 2nd half and playoffs is also very alarming. It's a GM's job to identify upcoming issues before they happen. You are supposed to prevent the car crash, not simply try to repair it after the fact.

The Garland problem is another huge concern. His value is absolutely decimated right now. How is Altman going to navigate that? Even though it's getting clearer every day that he and Mitchell have a very limited ceiling together, there is very little recourse to move off of him and get anything of substance in return.

That's not even bringing JB into the equation. Altman has pissed away an entire season of watching this team demonstrate very little development under a coach who has obviously been in way over his head for multiple years. He had a free pass to fire him last offseason after the team tanked against NYK and got mentally and physically bullied. It had poorly coached team written all over it and yet we find ourselves in the exact same spot a year later.

Is he really dumb enough to think JB wasn't a huge problem? The only other logical explanation to me would be he realized he built this roster poorly and that there was nothing he could do in the offseason to significantly change it. As a result, he keeps JB around to take all the heat and be the fall guy when things inevitably go south again.

Plan is probably to run it back again next year with a healthy Ty Jerome and Dean Wade. Their thinking, "adding those two is like adding to productive draft picks."

 

[Mr. Orange]

The long winter is coming. The Cavs are completely fucked. I’m talking the worst place in the NBA, purgatory for the next decade. Not good enough to contend and no way to hit the lotto til 2031. It’s over.

Come on over to the Guardians forum. The grill is hot, the pool is luke, and we have the best young team and skipper in the game.

 

[bushwick_bill]

Listened to the entire Fedor podcast today. He saved it for the very end, but this was confirmation of basically everything this board says:

QUOTE: “players in the lockeroom after this game were basically saying without actually saying it. JB you need to do something to create better looks for us on the offensive end”

THE PLAYERS KNOW THIS GUY SUCKS.

It's at the 47:45 point in the podcast, and yes, it's worth listening to it.

Just listen to this interview... All there... Clear to me...