Rockets shut down trade talks about Omer Asik

[Derek]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Go look at year two for elite or close to elite SG's. They're well out in left field when comparing them to Dion.

Can he be a very good player? Based on his god given gifts and potential? Sure.

Can he be what he is right now? Yeah.

I also understand Harden’s development but no one wants to acknowledge the physical gifts he has that Dion doesn’t? I.e. vastly superior size for a SG? Or the fact that he had to defer to two other All-Star players to begin his career?

Dion just isn’t in that situation. I’m happy to eat crow, people are just making him in to something he’s not at this point. He’s young, has shown some improvement, buoyed by a really hot stretch of 5-6 games. I’m interested to see where he levels off and settles in at. My guess is it is nowhere near his December shooting numbers.

When did I say he would be elite? I was just trying to figure out why you think he is going to be a worse player for his career than he already is right now.

He has already shown a great deal of improvement in his shooting and shot selection. If he can get his finishing ability back to where it was in the second half of last year, he's going to be looking like a very good player.

In November, Dion was 42%/42%
In December, he is 46%/38%

This isn't a guy who's numbers are inflated by a couple good games. He has been doing this all year.

 

[Pepe Silvia]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

We're gonna end up somehow taking on unwanted filler and getting a protected first rounder years down the road.

 

[KB]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

When did I say he would be elite? I was just trying to figure out why you think he is going to be a worse player for his career than he already is right now.

He has already shown a great deal of improvement in his shooting and shot selection. If he can get his finishing ability back to where it was in the second half of last year, he's going to be looking like a very good player.

In November, Dion was 42%/42%
In December, he is 46%/38%

This isn't a guy who's numbers are inflated by a couple good games. He has been doing this all year.

My favorite part of that persons post was talking about the 2nd year in the league for SG's and how Dions isn't close.....20 games through Dion's 2nd season in the league with numbers that are trending up.

Funny as shit when people talk themselves in circles then contradict themselves

 

[Triumph36]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Waiters could be better than Harden. In fact, I don't see any reason he won't be. He has to get more consistent with the jumper, but he already has superior driving ability, passing ability, and can be en elite defender. He just needs to clean some things and keep working like does.

no.

"i don't see any reason he won't be" is blind homerism. james harden is a top 10 player in the entire league. you don't see any reason why dion won't be a top 10 player? really?

i mean i like dion, but james harden is an elite sg. could dion be better? sure. is it likely? that's a different story.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Serious talks on Boston-Houston package for Asik have included Brandon Bass, Courtney Lee and a 1st round pick, sources tell Yahoo.</p>— Adrian Wojnarowski (@WojYahooNBA) <a href="https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/statuses/413407567449448449">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
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wasn't sure about this initially but i actually really like it for houston

bass is a solid defender and has a nice jumpshot, and lee is really good behind the arc. both have had issues with consistency, but if morey/mchale can get them to buy into their role i think this could work out well for houston.

 

[ice cream man]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Waiters and Harden are on completely opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to getting calls. :chuckles:

I think Harden's game is a bit overrated. I mean he can score. But now that he's labeled "superstar" and "the man," he's started to act like it. Not passing as much (when he was breaking out with the Thunder, everyone was raving about his ability to run the offense), playing 1-on-1 ball. Defense is an afterthought.

Probably more talented than Dion in terms of dribbling/shooting, but I agree that Dion can be in the conversation as one of the best SG's in the league pretty soon.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Go look at year two for elite or close to elite SG's. They're well out in left field when comparing them to Dion.

Okay. Here are some notable elite (or formerly elite) two-guards who are still in the league right now in their second years...

James Harden: 12.2 PTS, 2.1 AST, 3.1 REB, 43.6/34.9/84.3 splits in 26.7 minutes per game.

Kobe Bryant: 15.4 PTS, 2.5 AST, 3.1 REB, 42.8/34.1/79.4 splits in 26.0 minutes per game.

Eric Gordon: 16.9 PTS, 3.0 AST, 2.6 REB, 44.9/37.1/74.2 splits in 36.0 minutes per game.

Klay Thompson: 16.6 PTS, 2.2 AST, 3.7 REB, 42.2/40.1/84.1 splits in 35.8 minutes per game.

Arron Afflalo: 4.9 PTS, 0.6 AST, 1.8 REB, 43.7/40.2/81.7 splits in 16.7 minutes per game.

Manu Ginobili: 12.8 PTS, 3.8 AST, 4.5 REB, 41.8/35.9/80.2 splits in 29.4 minutes per game.


And now...

Dion Waiters: 14.9 PTS, 2.5 AST, 3.2 REB, 43.1/40.3/69.1 splits in 28.5 minutes per game.


Yes...Dion's second year clearly doesn't hold a candle to any of those other guys. :chuckles:

Honestly, the only exception to the above was Wade. His second year he was a monster. There are a few other guys I didn't include (like Joe Johnson) who fit into the same mold as the guys above. I just got sick of looking at stats.

Edit: And Dan, let this be a lesson not to talk out of your ass. People have this thing called the internet that gives us the ability to look up statistics that make you look stupid.

 

[RchfldCavRaised]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Go look at year two for elite or close to elite SG's. They're well out in left field when comparing them to Dion.

Can he be a very good player? Based on his god given gifts and potential? Sure.

Can he be what he is right now? Yeah.

I also understand Harden’s development but no one wants to acknowledge the physical gifts he has that Dion doesn’t? I.e. vastly superior size for a SG? Or the fact that he had to defer to two other All-Star players to begin his career?

Dion just isn’t in that situation. I’m happy to eat crow, people are just making him in to something he’s not at this point. He’s young, has shown some improvement, buoyed by a really hot stretch of 5-6 games. I’m interested to see where he levels off and settles in at. My guess is it is nowhere near his December shooting numbers.

Dan, I'm reading what you are saying and I'll step to the plate and give you some perspective on why I dont feel the same way I used to feel about Dion.

He's a big PG, stop trying to make him a SG and you will see his potential.

That seems to be your hold up and I'll tell you, as a SG, I feel the exact same way about him that you do. Felt that way this season, all the way up until Brown put him in his correct role and Dion accepted it.

As a PG, he has the potential to be the 2nd best player on our team and "I FEEL" maybe just outside of the top 10 pgs in the league (currently). Seriously. He is that good with the ball in his hands. The problem is that we drafted him to compliment Irving. And that was dumb, as he does not have the game to do that. But if you take that SG role that you want him to play off the table and look at him individually as a player without regard for fit on this roster, your valuation of him will be much higher.

I think its important that he continue playing as he has, in the role that he has. Right now, it works. As we keep moving forward, we'll have to see how the chemistry between he and Kyrie mature and if they learn to compliment each other while on the floor at the same time. If they simply cant, and Waiters is ok as a 6th man, Im happy with him. If they cant and Waiters wants more, then he'll be moved eventually hopefully for game changing point guard value.

Biggest mistake we can make, is lowering our valuation of him as a player/asset based on positional fit. Think of him as a PG who is big enough to play/defend some SGs and you will appreciate what he brings alot more.

 

[MoFlo]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Celtics, Rockets still haggling over which future first-round pick goes to Houston in Asik deal, sources tell Yahoo.</p>&mdash; Adrian Wojnarowski (@WojYahooNBA) <a href="https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/statuses/413438979984609280">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
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[tristan+kyrie=$]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Dion is gona be damn good...the thought of him and Kyrie in a few year gets me excited for the future of Cavs bball...perfect lineup would be those two starting...and a 3 and 4 who can shoot and stretch the floor and then a center who can protect the rim

 

[mhi]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Afflalo on the move ? They just said his out sick...

 

[MoFlo]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Proposed Houston-Boston deal includes no third team, sources tell Yahoo.</p>&mdash; Adrian Wojnarowski (@WojYahooNBA) <a href="https://twitter.com/WojYahooNBA/statuses/413449850894942208">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>It appears <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&amp;src=hash">#Cavs</a>, once involved in trade talks with <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Rockets&amp;src=hash">#Rockets</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Celtics&amp;src=hash">#Celtics</a>, done with discussions, at least for day. Y! Sports also reporting</p>&mdash; Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413450499908583425">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
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<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&amp;src=hash">#Cavs</a> don't want to shake up roster, move major pieces, as they are coming together of late, source said. Don't feel need for overhaul.</p>&mdash; Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413451248440852480">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
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[Vlad]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Earlier today...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&src=hash">#Cavs</a> GM Chris Grant has green light to make a deal, league sources say, as owner Dan Gilbert not happy, expects more this season. <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23nba&src=hash">#nba</a></p>— Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413386003370348544">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

now...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&src=hash">#Cavs</a> don't want to shake up roster, move major pieces, as they are coming together of late, source said. Don't feel need for overhaul.</p>— Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413451248440852480">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

anyone know where I can sign up to be a sports writer?

 

[catfish]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Earlier today...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&src=hash">#Cavs</a> GM Chris Grant has green light to make a deal, league sources say, as owner Dan Gilbert not happy, expects more this season. <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23nba&src=hash">#nba</a></p>— Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413386003370348544">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

now...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&src=hash">#Cavs</a> don't want to shake up roster, move major pieces, as they are coming together of late, source said. Don't feel need for overhaul.</p>— Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413451248440852480">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

anyone know where I can sign up to be a sports writer?

I think I would call The Bullshit Whisperer a blogger not writer.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Earlier today...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&src=hash">#Cavs</a> GM Chris Grant has green light to make a deal, league sources say, as owner Dan Gilbert not happy, expects more this season. <a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23nba&src=hash">#nba</a></p>— Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413386003370348544">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

now...

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p><a href="https://twitter.com/search?q=%23Cavs&src=hash">#Cavs</a> don't want to shake up roster, move major pieces, as they are coming together of late, source said. Don't feel need for overhaul.</p>— Sam The Bullshit Whisperer (@SamAmicoFSO) <a href="https://twitter.com/SamAmicoFSO/statuses/413451248440852480">December 18, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

anyone know where I can sign up to be a sports writer?

I mean, to be fair, the first one is about Gilbert and the second one is really about Grant. Just because Gilbert has given Grant the greenlight to make trades doesn't mean Grant has to make any. It just means Gilbert gave him the okay if the right deal comes along.

 

[Simon]

Re: Rockets approaching teams about Omer Asik

Interesting to note is that Bass was in the starting line up and is playing tonight.