The Transgender Issue

[David.]

Both of you mentioned gay couples/marriages. I think this is a bit different than that.

Who should control when the opposite sex is explained to people's children? What's to protect parents if they believe it is themselves? I don't think saying "I can guarantee your daughter will have seen a penis in her life before the incident" really suffices as an answer.

I'm not sure I understand..

doesn't "explaining the opposite sex" involve gay/straight information of children?


I think when you take the stigma away(as damien did when explaining homosexual relationships in public) it becomes much easier..

But you don't think explaining gender norm preference is easier than explaining actual sex acts?

 

[bcort]

Again (and I could be wrong on this as I'm not transgender), a transgender person probably isn't trying to draw attention to the fact they are transgender. They're generally trying to fit in and live their life. Whipping out a dick in the women's changing room, by definition, is drawing attention to yourself

However, to answer your question, just be honest with the kid. Or throw a movie on the ipad and stop for ice cream on the way home. Kids have about 5 second attention spans. They're easily distracted.

Could a transgender person not just say they're changing like everyone else in the room? Are you trying to portray all transgender people as shy, quiet individuals? Maybe most are? I don't know. But I feel like you're trying to generalize them all into that when there are almost no absolutes in this world.

As far as your solution... C'mon man.

 

[Damien O'Connel]

Again (and I could be wrong on this as I'm not transgender), a transgender person probably isn't trying to draw attention to the fact they are transgender. They're generally trying to fit in and live their life. Whipping out a dick in the women's changing room, by definition, is drawing attention to yourself

However, to answer your question, just be honest with the kid. Or throw a movie on the ipad and stop for ice cream on the way home. Kids have about 5 second attention spans. They're easily distracted.

It's a philosophical argument so we have to consider every scenario.

I wouldn't be trying to distract my kid from something that they were asking about, particularly if they seemed traumatized.

After the movie is over they're still going to think about it and be confused. How will that compound over time?

 

[David.]

I

Agree with your edit.

But now your daughter is seeing those dicks too, in this scenario. Does she want to avoid changing rooms altogether after that?

Someone said that they have 5 second attention spans, but traumatic experiences (a traumatic experience for a kid can be anything) can shape their brain chemistry for years to come.

Again, I don't know what I would say to my daughter in that situation. I guess it would be something like "He wants to be a girl, he just wasn't born that way."

I'm not sure how that would go...how she would rationalize it and make sense of it.

I think the question you posed is sort of an easy appeal to shock/emotion, but in practice it's like, one conversation you ever have to have with your kid and it could take five seconds and be painless..

Or be done before the situation happens..

Worst case scenario is awkward for twenty seconds if it's in public, but the kid is genuinely just trying to learn and figure out the world and is likely to feel less prejudice than an adult who's learned gender roles

 

[Damien O'Connel]

I'm not sure I understand..

doesn't "explaining the opposite sex" involve gay/straight information of children?


I think when you take the stigma away(as damien did when explaining homosexual relationships in public) it becomes much easier..

But you don't think explaining gender norm preference is easier than explaining actual sex acts?

You still haven't explained what it means to be a man or a woman to me.

How can I be expected to explain it to my kid?

 

[bcort]

I'm not sure I understand..

doesn't "explaining the opposite sex" involve gay/straight information of children?


I think when you take the stigma away(as damien did when explaining homosexual relationships in public) it becomes much easier..

But you don't think explaining gender norm preference is easier than explaining actual sex acts?

I would say when children are young (I don't have any) you don't have to explain sexual acts, as the child probably doesn't have much idea about sex in general (I'm thinking in the 4-7 range?). You can "get away" with exactly what Damien said as far as saying they love each other just like mommy and daddy.

 

[Jack Brickman]

While I personally don't give a fuck about this issue (people can pee where they want), it probably cost Pat McCrory the election in North Carolina. I'll be very surprised if he or the Republicans survive this issue come the fall. They pissed off so many people, and cost the state a lot of jobs.

 

[bcort]

I

I think the question you posed is sort of an easy appeal to shock/emotion, but in practice it's like, one conversation you ever have to have with your kid and it could take five seconds and be painless..

Or be done before the situation happens..

Worst case scenario is awkward for twenty seconds if it's in public, but the kid is genuinely just trying to learn and figure out the world and is likely to feel less prejudice than an adult who's learned gender roles

I don't know but I wonder if there's been any research of children (I'm sure there has) that were exposed to the body of the opposite sex earlier and what that did for them.

 

[czvo]

Could a transgender person not just say they're changing like everyone else in the room? Are you trying to portray all transgender people as shy, quiet individuals? Maybe most are? I don't know. But I feel like you're trying to generalize them all into that when there are almost no absolutes in this world.

As far as your solution... C'mon man.

I was mostly joking with my answer to the kid question. No tongue in cheek font on message boards.

As far as the generalization, yes, I even said in my post I was probably doing that. That's been my experience being around the few people I knew were transgender or have thought might be. Honestly, I don't give a shit if a person thinks they're a man, woman, alien, lizard... whatever. It doesn't impact me, why should I give a shit?

 

[David.]

You still haven't explained what it means to be a man or a woman to me.

How can I be expected to explain it to my kid?

If the actual question is just "how do I explain it to my kid", then yes, I would say "they just want to dress that way".. There's no real need to get into anything super deep, if this is the same sort of cliche "how do I explain guys kissing" situation

If I'm explaining to my kid, for real, I say "FOR some reason, girls normally like Barbie, and dress and act certain ways and boys bla bla bla.. This person likes to dress more like a boy or a girl"

I need some specification.. Like how old are the kids, is this in public when it's an awkward situation or an I genuinely trying to teach them

 

[Damien O'Connel]

I

I think the question you posed is sort of an easy appeal to shock/emotion, but in practice it's like, one conversation you ever have to have with your kid and it could take five seconds and be painless..

Or be done before the situation happens..

Worst case scenario is awkward for twenty seconds if it's in public, but the kid is genuinely just trying to learn and figure out the world and is likely to feel less prejudice than an adult who's learned gender roles

Disregard, responding to your last post

 

[David.]

I don't know but I wonder if there's been any research of children (I'm sure there has) that were exposed to the body of the opposite sex earlier and what that did for them.

I don't think being exposed is as much an issue as the context is..

If it's intrusive, aggressive, damaging, I'd imagine the actual situation is the damaging variable rather than simply the visual of a dick, balls, scissors

 

[Damien O'Connel]

If the actual question is just "how do I explain it to my kid", then yes, I would say "they just want to dress that way".. There's no real need to get into anything super deep, if this is the same sort of cliche "how do I explain guys kissing" situation

If I'm explaining to my kid, for real, I say "FOR some reason, girls normally like Barbie, and dress and act certain ways and boys bla bla bla.. This person likes to dress more like a boy or a girl"

I need some specification.. Like how old are the kids, is this in public when it's an awkward situation or an I genuinely trying to teach them

We're not talking about dressing, though. We're talking about disrobing in the same room that your child is disrobing in.

It's easy to explain a cross-dresser, as you said.

It's not easy to explain why a grown ass man is getting naked in front of your daughter when "WOMEN" is written on the door.

 

[Damien O'Connel]

I don't think being exposed is as much an issue as the context is..

If it's intrusive, aggressive, damaging, I'd imagine the actual situation is the damaging variable rather than simply the visual of a dick, balls, scissors

What if your kid gets horny in the dressing room when he sees a naked woman?

What if that's the first naked woman he's seen?

If it were me at 5-6, I'd be latching onto porn mighty quick after I got that peek.

It would stay with me.

 

[Jack Brickman]

We're not talking about dressing, though. We're talking about disrobing in the same room that your child is disrobing in.

It's easy to explain a cross-dresser, as you said.

It's not easy to explain why a grown ass man is getting naked in front of your daughter when "WOMEN" is written on the door.

By the time your kid is old enough to disrobe in a gym bathroom, they're probably old enough to understand the transgender issue. Where else are they going to hypothetically see these naked people? In a regular bathroom, a woman who considers herself a man will use a stall (or if she's post-op she'll just use a urinal, so nothing to see there except for a dick, which is expected in a men's room). If it's a women's restroom, it's all stalls so there's really no issue, and I have to assume a man who considers himself a woman probably pees sitting down anyway.

Further, I'd assume most of these transgender people understand context, and probably aren't just going to get naked in front of your kid knowing that they have a dick in the room marked WOMEN.