#52 DeShone Kizer

[The Human Q-Tip]

Quarterbacks throw footballs. It's harder with a defense trying to knock your head off. Hope that helped.

Honest to God, it doesn't. The problem may be that I simply don't understand exactly what your position is.

I thought you said you wouldn't play Kizer any more than the last game or two of the season, and that anything more than that would be "irresponsible". You talked about that being the general rule for non-Luck rookie QB's, mentioning Elway and Lynch in Denver.

But then you said that you think the Browns should roll with the "most prepared guy who gives them the best chance to win" which sounds like you might be willing to play the rookie QB if (and I'd agree that it's an "if", not a "when") he happens to be that guy at some point in the season.

So that's my point of confusion. I can't tell whether you're laying down an "absolutely not" or a "we'll have to see how he progresses".

 

[Lyst]

???????

We added Pro-Bowler Kevin Zeitler at RG, get Bitonio back at LG, and signed J.C. Tretter to replace Cam Erving at center. We massively upgraded all three interior line positions from what they were last season.

The running game begins with the OL, and this is probably the best one we've had since the Return. Actually, since a good bit before that as well. The closest would probably be when we had Thomas, Steinbach, and Mack for a few years, though the right side of those lines was a disaster. This line looks to be as good or better because RG will be a strength rather than a hole.

I really can't fathom the claim that we made no changes this offseason in terms of our running game prospects.

Are you telling me that is more important to have a talented Oline than talented running backs?

I am sorry but the Oline is not going to make a mediocre undrafted runningback substantially better.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Are you telling me that is more important to have a talented Oline than talented running backs?

Actually, that's not what I was telling you. Regardless of which is more important, major improvements to the offensive line surely don't count as "no improvement in that respect," which was what you claimed.
[/quote]I am sorry but the Oline is not going to make a mediocre undrafted runningback substantially better.[/QUOTE]

Now that you mention it, I'd bet that if you put Crowell behind the Cowboy's OL last year, and made Eliott run behind ours, Crowell would have had more YPC. Zeke's the better back, but the difference in offensive lines was enormous.

 

[Lyst]

Now that you mention it, I'd bet that if you put Crowell behind the Cowboy's OL last year, and made Eliott run behind ours, Crowell would have had more YPC. Zeke's the better back, but the difference in offensive lines was enormous.

See I do not see this. The team around you can make you a better player, but it cannot catapult you to being someone that you are not. Crow having Cowboys O-line is not going to turn him into Adrian Peterson (Or Zeke for the matter). It will make him be the best version of himself that he could be, a rich-person's Crowell.

 

[Jack Brickman]

Are you telling me that is more important to have a talented Oline than talented running backs?

I'd say offensive line is far more important than the talent of the running back. A great offensive line can make just about anyone look good to great. A bad offensive line can make a star RB look mediocre.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

See I do not see this.

You really think that flipping OL's wouldn't shift YPC by 0.3?

The team around you can make you a better player, but it cannot catapult you to being someone that you are not. Crow having Cowboys O-line is not going to turn him into Adrian Peterson (Or Zeke for the matter).

Of course it won't. But he'll run a lot better behind it than he would have behind a crappy line, which (again) is why your statement that there was "NO CHANGES" to the running game this offseason is bogus. Our running game should improve because our OL improved significantly. I can't even believe someone is disputing that.

 

[Lyst]

You really think that flipping OL's wouldn't shift YPC by 0.3?



Of course it won't. But he'll run a lot better behind it than he would have behind a crappy line, which (again) is why your statement that there was "NO CHANGES" to the running game this offseason is bogus. Our running game should improve because our OL improved significantly. I can't even believe someone is disputing that.

Is it really that hard to believe? We have shitty runningbacks. I don't care if we have Gods as our OLine, it won't change the fact that they are not good. Not good enough to rely on at least, which is what my original post is about.

If you want to wear brown and orange colored glasses and say Duke and Crow are anything more than they are, that is on you bud.

 

[MikeOC33]

We have made no changes in that aspect, I expect us to be no more than subpar running-wise. And we cannot rely on it.

In addition to the added linemen that Q-tip mentioned, they also hired Bob Wylie, who I think will make as big an impact as Gregg Williams.

http://dawgpounddaily.com/2017/01/22/cleveland-browns-arrival-bob-wylie-means-return-fundamentals/

 

[Jack Brickman]

Is it really that hard to believe? We have shitty runningbacks. I don't care if we have Gods as our OLine, it won't change the fact that they are not good. Not good enough to rely on at least, which is what my original post is about.

If you want to wear brown and orange colored glasses and say Duke and Crow are anything more than they are, that is on you bud.

Crowell was actually pretty good last year, and that was behind an abysmal offensive line. Our line has improved greatly since last season, at least on paper. I'd expect to see Crowell look even better this year. I don't consider him an elite back or anything, but you don't have to be if your line is good.

 

[Triplethreat]

Lyst getting straight up murdered in here.

That was an all time bad take.

 

[Tornicade]

The problem for Clevelands line is that it had holes in it that negated the great seasons put in by Thomas, Greco and Bitonio.
Erving allowed 30 qb pressures and constantly allowed rushing lanes to instantly collapse.

Last year defensive schemes could work around Thomas and Bitonio. This year those schemes shouldn't be able to as effectively..

This bodes well for Crowell who should be able to hit the holes.

Cleveland ran the ball 35% of the time and had the second lowest rushing attempts of any team last season.

yet they were 7th in rushing attempts that produced more than 10 yards.

Meanwhile Cleveland was 2nd in rushing yards per attempt.

of course If the browns are down by double digits at halftime again on a consistent basis ..the running game wont matter.

 

[Chris]

Lyst getting straight up murdered in here.

That was an all time bad take.

Lyst is always good for an awful take or two.

 

[sportscoach]

Are you telling me that is more important to have a talented Oline than talented running backs?

I am sorry but the Oline is not going to make a mediocre undrafted runningback substantially better.

If you have Peterson in his prime behind the worst OLine and the worst RB behind the best OLine they will average about the same numbers if not the worst RB averaging better numbers. I don't think any RB had ever lead the NFL in yards without having at least a half way decent line. We have a top 5 OLine on paper and even putting the same RB will increase his numbers just because we have better OLine. Also Crowell may not be a top 10 RB, but no team would complain if he was their lead back since he is a solid RB

 

[sportscoach]

Either way for Kizer, having a better OLine and athletic TEs, it is possible he will do alright as the starting QB, but we have to start the best QB because of the fact I know Haslem wants to do better than 1-15 and so does the whole team. We have to start the guy who gives us the best chance of winning regardless of who it is. I know we need to worry about 18s draft, but I am sure Hue and the coaching staff will know by the end of the season if we have to draft another QB. If Osweiler ends up being our starter and has a good season we may keep him and not draft anyone in 18 to. It's too early to know what we are doing in 18s draft, but we have to trust the brains of the operation and Hue to say what they need

 

[Triplethreat]

Your infatuation with Osweiler gives me cancer.